#koq2 buffer saved on Tue Jan 27 21:58:28 1998
*** Now talking in #koq2
 

Offense

<Jarv-KoQ> First off, I know when things start to break down,
<Jarv-KoQ> then I tend not to communicate as much...
<Jarv-KoQ> seems like the same thing occurs with most everyone here.
<Jarv-KoQ> Offense must communicate their positions more
<Jarv-KoQ> A few did a great job about it,
<Jarv-KoQ> but for the most part -- it seems our O was not behaving like it  was in our practices... agreed?
<Jarv-KoQ> We need to "regroup" more
<Jarv-KoQ> and "acknowledge" it and make an effort
<Jarv-KoQ> to be there

<Crotchless-KoQ> when things break down dante cusses a continuous stream

<Jenkins-KoQ> scout needs to scan & report enemy position

<Jarv-KoQ> I neded help from Offense to fix our "problems."
<Jarv-KoQ> What else do you think, upon review, that we could have done better?
<Jarv-KoQ> Open floor.

<Snare-KoQ> dont take the bridge when 2 lpb snipers, no matter what
<Snare-KoQ> go over, camp the snipers, then tell the offense its clear

<Jarv-KoQ> What if they close the water well area?

<Leiodes-KoQ> O needs to attack in numbers, more. not all the time butt in spurts, by doing so we can control the snipers better

<Kouros-KoQ> maybe we need to learn the "water jump" trick..

<Dante-KoQ> i can  still get to the sniper area even if they close the well
<Dante-KoQ> i can wj

<Jarv-KoQ> (1) Communicate more,
<Jarv-KoQ> (2) Regroup More (attack in #s)
<Jarv-KoQ> (3) Camp on lpb snipers

<Snare-KoQ> cover each other

<Jarv-KoQ> (4) Cover each other more

<Hodge-KoQ> save nail grenades for when they are needed

<Snare-KoQ> listen to where ppl are, and try and help them

<Jenkins-KoQ> group up

<Jarv-KoQ> (5) Better use of grenades (in general)

<Jenkins-KoQ> communicate ENEMY POSITION

<Crotchless-KoQ> be careful where you throw grenades  dont take friendly  armor if you cna help it

<Kouros-KoQ> possibly change classes to force their defense to adapt to us,  instead of us adapting to what they're doing...try to keep them off balance more..

<Snare-KoQ> some ppl need to take out sentries for scouts and or pyros

<Jarv-KoQ> Crotalus, did that happen much to you in the scrimmage?

<Crotchless-KoQ> it's always a problem
<Crotchless-KoQ> when we bunch up

<WarTribe-KoQ> report sentry locations, there hard to find in the shadows

<Jarv-KoQ> Really?

<Jarv-KoQ> (6) Report Sentry locations and take them out!

<Snare-KoQ> if a scout will tell me where sentry is, i can usually take them  out first try, so if we time it right, scout canmake it farther into base

<Dante-KoQ> i think that if we  can control the bridge we can  get to  their fort with 200 armor  and have a muchg better chance to  cap

<WarTribe-KoQ> i may die 3 time just to find where it is

<Crotchless-KoQ> slow nail scouts can take out sentrys as fast as rockets

<Jenkins-KoQ> scout is good sentry killer

<Crotchless-KoQ> medics faster

<Snare-KoQ> yeah, we all need to practice that, killing sentries as scout

<Jarv-KoQ> Ok, we have 6 good points...

<Snare-KoQ> use zoom scripts if needed (i do)

<Jarv-KoQ> anything else for offense?

<Snare-KoQ> i miss the demoman clearing things out

<Leiodes-KoQ> same here Snare

Defense

<Jarv-KoQ> Now lets focus on defense...
<Jarv-KoQ> I know a huge tactical error I made is to
<Jarv-KoQ> not protect the ramp area

<Crotchless-KoQ> i saw a demoman jump the elevator with a single pipe   i need to work it out
<Jenkins-KoQ> engineer cant do it alone

<Jarv-KoQ> and their Scouts had free access into our base
<Jarv-KoQ> Yes he can
<Jarv-KoQ> I did it when I switched over
<Jarv-KoQ> to eng in game #2
<Jarv-KoQ> You can do it fine by yourself...
<Jarv-KoQ> we can't ever leave it open again.

<Snare-KoQ> soldier or demoman works to, just not as good for scouts

<Cadrys-KoQ> eng cant do gun alone in ramp room, needs floater soldier

<Crotchless-KoQ> build a dispenser on the elevator to hold it up  :)

<WarTribe-KoQ> i wouldnt mind guarding the spiral

<Cadrys-KoQ> Jarv, by then the heavies were ignoring the ramp or something, had steady stream in basement
<Cadrys-KoQ> with no warning of spiral vs elevator

<Jarv-KoQ> Cadrys, I had numerous kills
<Jarv-KoQ> as an engineer in the 2nd match

<Cadrys-KoQ> *shrug*  last few games, I've spent more time respawning after getting killed while rebuilding gun

<Jarv-KoQ> Knowing that we will always atleast station
<Jarv-KoQ> someone on our ramps (Antonin's biggest gripe about our D)

<Snare-KoQ> did anyone notice where tominator put sentry?
<Snare-KoQ> it may be more effective

<Jarv-KoQ> Yeah I noticed that too
<Jarv-KoQ> mixed feelings
<Jarv-KoQ> but worth a try
<Jarv-KoQ> You what is the minimum number of people
<Jarv-KoQ> that we can use to protect our flag?
<Jarv-KoQ> we MUST protect our ramp...
<Jarv-KoQ> Open Floor.

<Jenkins-KoQ> minimum
<Jenkins-KoQ> 3
<Cadrys-KoQ> (1)  O must advance and damage their O incoming
<Cadrys-KoQ> min 3, four much safer
<Jenkins-KoQ> but,
<Jenkins-KoQ> that's not including a slot for a sniper
<Jenkins-KoQ> hehe
<Jenkins-KoQ> demo, soldier, pyro/soldier
<Jenkins-KoQ> or
<Jenkins-KoQ> 2 demos, soldier
<Jenkins-KoQ> then me (soldier) would roam basement
<Jenkins-KoQ> and eng would cover ramps
<Jenkins-KoQ> no
<Jenkins-KoQ> hwguy must be stationary
<Jenkins-KoQ> he's too slow
<Jenkins-KoQ> only one spot for him

<Kouros-KoQ> it's a natch for the flagroom..

<Leiodes-KoQ> I would like to see us try the 2 demo's in the basement, see how effective it is

<Crotchless-KoQ> scouts run around hw

<Snare-KoQ> gotta get buy soldier and demo pipes first though

<Cadrys-KoQ> Im curious, do we ever use detpacks as part of D?

<Snare-KoQ> hwguy prob is one concussion makes him useless

<Jenkins-KoQ> here's what I'd do
<Jenkins-KoQ> 2 demos
<Jenkins-KoQ> soldier roaming
<Jenkins-KoQ> demos each pipe 3 or 4 pbombs in choke pts
<Jenkins-KoQ> spiral exit
<Jenkins-KoQ> and elevator shaft
<Jenkins-KoQ> soldier roams
<Jenkins-KoQ> they can collapse back in if the outer shell is breached

<Snare-KoQ> elevator should be ok with eng
<Snare-KoQ> we need a demo at falg hall at all times

<Jenkins-KoQ> ok
<Jenkins-KoQ> one at flag hall
<Jenkins-KoQ> one at spiral exit
<Jenkins-KoQ> soldier roams
<Jenkins-KoQ> spiral guard gets 2 pipes

<Snare-KoQ> soldier at spial works good, thats what DV does

<Jenkins-KoQ> goalie gets 5

<Snare-KoQ> he can see their feet before they can shoot at him
<Snare-KoQ> i think demo at flag, all pipes, soldier aspiral exit, and soldier roamin basement would work great

<Cadrys-KoQ> soldier at spiral worked well vs DV once in place

<Snare-KoQ> eng lets basement know when gun down, then romaing soldier covers elv

<Jenkins-KoQ> sounds good

<WarTribe-KoQ> i think pyro in spiral is better. he can easily stand in a scouts way, while flameing
<WarTribe-KoQ> and use rockets

<Snare-KoQ> anyone notice how i used pipes in our 5 on 5 scrimmage?

<Crotchless-KoQ> I think we may be placing a little too much enphasis on the DV scrim.  Remember   we had a lot of crippled players

<Leiodes-KoQ> Good point wart

<Snare-KoQ> not ideal, but i think switiching between 2 pipe setups keeps them off guard
<Snare-KoQ> soldier at spiral exit is better i think

<WarTribe-KoQ> i have been doing it to cads and danta wall week

<Crotchless-KoQ> pyro can't take out a scout fast enough

<WarTribe-KoQ> stand infrount of them, and they just keep running into you

<Snare-KoQ> but we should try it

<WarTribe-KoQ> while i shoot flames
<WarTribe-KoQ> i was surprised how fast scouts die in flames

Ant's suggestions

<Jarv-KoQ> here's a quickie of what Ant
<Jarv-KoQ> adds to our D:
<Jarv-KoQ> (1) can't abandon ramp
<Jarv-KoQ> (2) cover more chokes
<Jarv-KoQ> (3) he doesn't think we should run a pro-offense set, that we should always have more people on D than O in a 10x10 setting

<Jarv-KoQ> Offense
<Jarv-KoQ> (1) they didnt seem to work together well
<Jarv-KoQ> (2) they let DV scouts pass them up too easily
<Jarv-KoQ> (3) they need to vary up attack front.. he thinks we should use the grate area more than the sniper loft.

<Jarv-KoQ> Those are his opinions.
<Jarv-KoQ> Anyway,
<Jarv-KoQ> I think we had some good ideas here tonight
<Jarv-KoQ> I will save this buffer
<Jarv-KoQ> and connect it to our websiet
<Jarv-KoQ> so we can use it for references
<Jarv-KoQ> Anyone wish to add anything?
 

<WarTribe-KoQ> think placeing pyro in spiral is good idea

<Cadrys-KoQ> two guys working together are ten times, not two, more effective than loner

<Snare-KoQ> 4/6 works fine for lesser clans, but for the big boys, AA, >V<, IC, APr, we are gonna need offense

<Kouros-KoQ> comm is key

<Cadrys-KoQ> ...if your offensive line pushes their line back, you win?

<Leiodes-KoQ> yes

<Snare-KoQ> thats what AA does consitently

<WarTribe-KoQ> aa plays apr tomorrow

<Dante-KoQ> as a whole they are better dm players

Weekly Scrimmage with DV
 

<Jarv-KoQ> using Thursday as a regular Scrimmage/CA day with DV?

<Leiodes-KoQ> cool

<Jenkins-KoQ> only

<Kouros-KoQ> cool by me

<Cadrys-KoQ> works for me

<Dante-KoQ> k

<Jenkins-KoQ> if we scrimm as often as we CA
<Jenkins-KoQ> yeah

<Jarv-KoQ> Dunno about that
<Jarv-KoQ> Anyway,

<Kouros-KoQ> maybe a 30min CA, and a 30min scrim?

<Snare-KoQ> CA is fun, but it wastes alot of time

<Jarv-KoQ> DV may want to scrim this Thursday night as well

<Snare-KoQ> 75% of time your are waiting

<Jarv-KoQ> so we might have 3 scrims on Thursday
<Jarv-KoQ> which would be VERY busy for us,
<Jarv-KoQ> but good too.

End of #koq2 buffer   Tue Jan 27 21:58:28 1998